Authenticity of Veteran Arms Brown Bess Muskets

[PathfinderNC]

And why does someone seek to stay anonymous yet purports to be building high quality locks and guns, yet snows no clear photos of anything?
Fakery, I suspect

 

[FlinterNick]

And why does someone seeks to stay anonymous yet purports to be building high quality locks and guns, yet snows no clear photos of anything?
Fakery, I suspect

Anonymous usually means, doesn’t want to be located or publicly known for one or more grievances

 

[Commodore Swab]

And why does someone seeks to stay anonymous yet purports to be building high quality locks and guns, yet snows no clear photos of anything?
Fakery, I suspect

No interest in selling here, I have other sources to sell thru. I prefer to sell/trade in person. There are countless posts and pictures of what I have built, im sorry you missed them. Most of what I do is earlier time period and most of the people here are into more modern weaponry.

 

[PathfinderNC]

No interest in selling here, I have other sources to sell thru. I prefer to sell/trade in person. There are countless posts and pictures of what I have built, im sorry you missed them. Most of what I do is earlier time period and most of the people here are into more modern weaponry.

Yeah, I saw a few photos a while ago. That was plenty.

 

[Clark Badgett]

No interest in selling here, I have other sources to sell thru. I prefer to sell/trade in person. There are countless posts and pictures of what I have built, im sorry you missed them. Most of what I do is earlier time period and most of the people here are into more modern weaponry.

Ain’t this some pure bovine feces. Many here have interests that coincide right into the pirate cosplay era you like.

 

[wganz]

It wasn’t bad grammar, i would call it poor internet etiquette to quote someone or miss-quote someone accidentally. I work in IT i see this all the time. Keep our conversations straight, clear and to the point creates less confusion, and upsets less people such as yourself.

Got a good one for you. Worked for the largest healthcare insurance reimbursement company in the country. This small 3 hospital group had continual problems with getting their files zipped up to ftp over to us. They were constantly whining about the time to process their files. Sorry, if the zip file is corrupted, cannot extract the data, then I cannot get it to load. Their head IT lady emailed me about what the problem was. I sent back an email that listed the different things for them to check which I had seen over the years that caused that issue. A large number were from insufficient disk space for the temporary files created while building the zip file. They were also in contract negotiations at that time to renew their contract. She edits my email then forwards it to our CEO claiming that I had insulted her by adding text that said she didn't know how to use pkZip then the chain demands a discount on the contract due to this insult. The useless VP we had was up in arms and wanted to fire me immediately over it. I had a copy still in the OUT box and forwarded it to the C staff. Told them to use the MD5sum that MS Outlook creates on each email to verify that it was not altered. Then they were miffed at the BS and just signed the contract without the discount.

So, yeah, know all about peeps altering text on you.

 

[dave_person]

Hi Guys,
Why the animosity? I greatly admire Commodore Swab's commitment to supplying a need. CS, well done and good on you!!! Reenactors and living history folks are never going to have enough quality and historically correct firearms available to them. They will have to make do with Pedersolis, old Mirokus, and India-made guns. I rarely now upgrade any of those guns except to work over Pedersoli and Miroku locks for some groups. I simply do not have the time anymore for them. I could be making just historically correct British and French military arms from TRS parts for the rest of my life given how many folks request them from me and are willing to pay the price. However, I don't want to be making only muskets and military guns because I've developed through hard work all the skills necessary to make the highest quality British, European, and American guns from the 16th thru early 19th centuries. What a waste of my skills to only make muskets. I post threads about reworking repros and making muskets from TRS parts not to advertise my work but to provide information to you all how to help yourselves. Even TRS parts are no guarantee of a proper musket because it depends on whether the builder knows what he is doing. I spend a lot of effort attempting to educate folks about those details. Anyway, there simply aren't enough Nick Gendas, Richard Coltons, Mike Brooks, and a handful of others out there who can make historically correct muskets even from TRS parts. Commercial repros will be the norm but my hope is that the owners don't delude themselves into thinking they have a gun representative of the originals. They don't and while their uniforms may be historically perfect, their arms likely will never measure up and I hope they don't misrepresent them as true copies.

dave

 

[Sam squanch]

You guys got verbally spanked by Dave Person! Now behave…

 

[FlinterNick]

Hi Guys,
Why the animosity? I greatly admire Commodore Swab's commitment to supplying a need. CS, well done and good on you!!! Reenactors and living history folks are never going to have enough quality and historically correct firearms available to them. They will have to make do with Pedersolis, old Mirokus, and India-made guns. I rarely now upgrade any of those guns except to work over Pedersoli and Miroku locks for some groups. I simply do not have the time anymore for them. I could be making just historically correct British and French military arms from TRS parts for the rest of my life given how many folks request them from me and are willing to pay the price. However, I don't want to be making only muskets and military guns because I've developed through hard work all the skills necessary to make the highest quality British, European, and American guns from the 16th thru early 19th centuries. What a waste of my skills to only make muskets. I post threads about reworking repros and making muskets from TRS parts not to advertise my work but to provide information to you all how to help yourselves. Even TRS parts are no guarantee of a proper musket because it depends on whether the builder knows what he is doing. I spend a lot of effort attempting to educate folks about those details. Anyway, there simply aren't enough Nick Gendas, Richard Coltons, Mike Brooks, and a handful of others out there who can make historically correct muskets even from TRS parts. Commercial repros will be the norm but my hope is that the owners don't delude themselves into thinking they have a gun representative of the originals. They don't and while their uniforms may be historically perfect, their arms likely will never measure up and I hope they don't misrepresent them as true copies.

dave

Thanks Dave ! Much obliged and agree with everything you’ve stated.

 

[ArmorerRoy]

 

[Aglukan]

View attachment 327578

Lots of respect for the folks who help me out here especially Dave. Green Green here, Lots of strong attitudes in here create an atmosphere of animosity in all very poor etiquette and that goes for commodore too. Commodore it’s quick to to be an echo of a highly talented person like Dave and judge others while being nameless or expert advise without offering any exhibits of it. My confusion of a statement lead into an argument which I’m not gonna apologize for being confused because it was confusing, poor etiquette . Commodore you have earned my respect as well as my silence because you seem to draw negativity and I don’t do negative energy so I’m going to ignore you. Auggie

 

[Commodore Swab]

Lots of respect for the folks who help me out here especially Dave. Green Green here, Lots of strong attitudes in here create an atmosphere of animosity in all very poor etiquette and that goes for commodore too. Commodore it’s quick to to be an echo of a highly talented person like Dave and judge others while being nameless or expert advise without offering any exhibits of it. My confusion of a statement lead into an argument which I’m not gonna apologize for being confused because it was confusing, poor etiquette . Commodore you have earned my respect as well as my silence because you seem to draw negativity and I don’t do negative energy so I’m going to ignore you. Auggie

There is as Dave stated animosity toward me in this thread. In the past there have been disagreements. There have been threads where I have demonstrated before, after, results ect. Most people that offer anything positive regarding pieces from India take a lot of flak and in the past I haven't backed down. Dave does beautiful work but it's very different than what I do, mostly custom blunderbusses.

With the animosity toward anyone who speaks up for Indian built pieces it should be no surprise I remain anonymous. Whether or not you have me ignored the response is not just for you.

 

[Coinneach]

I’m familiar with wood types this is not any type of teak i have seen. For now its mystery wood.

Best to ask Rudyard, he'd know because he had boots on the ground years ago when he sojourned there.

 

[Clark Badgett]

There is as Dave stated animosity toward me in this thread. In the past there have been disagreements. There have been threads where I have demonstrated before, after, results ect. Most people that offer anything positive regarding pieces from India take a lot of flak and in the past I haven't backed down. Dave does beautiful work but it's very different than what I do, mostly custom blunderbusses.
View attachment 327597
With the animosity toward anyone who speaks up for Indian built pieces it should be no surprise I remain anonymous. Whether or not you have me ignored the response is not just for you.

Don’t try to play victim here. You have caused enough grief to those who speak against the shoddy nature of the India muskets.

 

[FlinterNick]

Don’t try to play victim here. You have caused enough grief to those who speak against the shoddy nature of the India muskets.

4 locked out threads and counting.

 

[FlinterNick]

There is as Dave stated animosity toward me in this thread. In the past there have been disagreements. There have been threads where I have demonstrated before, after, results ect. Most people that offer anything positive regarding pieces from India take a lot of flak and in the past I haven't backed down. Dave does beautiful work but it's very different than what I do, mostly custom blunderbusses.
View attachment 327597
With the animosity toward anyone who speaks up for Indian built pieces it should be no surprise I remain anonymous. Whether or not you have me ignored the response is not just for you.

Got any pictures of the lock area and side plate ?

 

[PathfinderNC]

I had him on Ignore for about a year and yesterday unblocked him and saw this thread and, yup, nothing has changed.
Back to Ignore he goes.
No need to waste time with people like that.

 

[dave_person]

The barrel was rifled because you requested it to be rifled, just like that queen Ann pistol you showed everyone a few years ago with the rifled barrel. If you ask the rifle shoppe to rifle a barrel, they will, it’s that simple.

Well enough, we actually know each other, and from what i know of you, i understand know why you’ve chosen to be anonymous, see ya around Mike..

Hi Nick,
I have both the turn off and Scottish pistol part sets in my shop. None were ordered to be rifled as they both should be smooth bored but TRS sent rifled barrels by default. They don't mention the rifling in their descriptions in their catalog so unless otherwise informed, the buyer has no idea about the rifling and assumed they would be smooth as most originals were. This one will eventually be going to Fort Dobbs in NC.

dave

 

[FlinterNick]

Hi Nick,
I have both the turn off and Scottish pistol part sets in my shop. None were ordered to be rifled as they both should be smooth bored but TRS sent rifled barrels by default. They don't mention the rifling in their descriptions in their catalog so unless otherwise informed, the buyer has no idea about the rifling and assumed they would be smooth as most originals were. This one will eventually be going to Fort Dobbs in NC.

dave

Interesting Dave ! I think it’s cool I kinda want one

Cheers from Monmouth today see you in kempton

 

[cebusey]

Hi Aglukan,
I have no idea what differences there are between Loyalist, Veteran Arms, and Middlesex Valley Traders sold guns. Working with reenactors I have had guns from all of those suppliers in my shop at some point. They all required extensive work on the locks. We rarely accept India-made guns to work on anymore because they all have been massive consumers of time and the end result works mechanically but is never very satisfying relative to historical accuracy, which is usually our goal for any work we do. I will say that none were any more historically accurate than any other and none were very well made compared with pre-industrial 18th century standards. Here are some examples of locks that came in to be worked over.

Tumbler holes too big, holes off center, screws drilled at wrong angles, dished out tumbler holes so the flintcocks ground against the lock plate, etc. Despite the deficiencies, working on these and other poorly made flintlocks taught me an important lesson. All of them worked somewhat and several had been decent performing locks for many years before they came to me. It demonstrates that flintlocks need to be well made but they don't need the super fine tolerances lauded today on CNC machined locks. That level of precision is overkill and unnecessary. Flintlocks are not jet engines needing precise parts rotating thousands of RPMs for hours. The best flintlocks of all time were made by hand in England during the 1st quarter of the 19th century. They were hand made using simple jigs, templates, and cutters. Even crudely made locks can work pretty well without a great level of precision. However, they need proper geometry and properly heat treated parts. Sometimes India-made locks fail in both respects.

dave

Hi Dave -
Any possibility that you could identify your excellent photos of incredibly poor quality as to which company the locks were imported by? I am surprised that you included Loyalist as I have had good quality products from them including one pistol I have had for over 20 years without any need besides normal cleaning and lubrication of the lock to keep it going. I wish I could say the same for the Pedersoli locks I have encountered/owned.