Buck&Ball

[George]

Think "Battle of Oriskany."

The Pennsylvania Gazette
August 27, 1777
FISHKILL, August 21. Extract of a letter from Albany, August 18.

"Since my last I have had the pleasure of seeing Col. Willet; he nearly agrees with the account I gave you in my last of the engagement he had with the enemy. He however adds, that from all the accounts he could collect from the Indians and inhabitants near the fort, Sir John Johnson fell in the engagement. The killed and wounded of the enemy in both engagements (General Herkemer’s and Col. Willet’s) from all that can be collected, exceeds 300. Those that were in General Herkemer’s all agree that they killed and wounded that number; for they say that the Indians were more than half drunk and shewed themselves more openly than has ever been known, and the regulars marched on very boldly three deep, and our people, known to Indian wars, placed themselves immediately behind trees, and made great havock among them, their cartridges being made up of three buck shot and a bullet. Some say they have seen three fall in a shot; however the most moderate computation exceeds 300. The Indians got such a severe drubbing that the greater part have left them and are gone home.

Spence

 

[George]

For those that say "what's the point", do you think that 5 or 6 or 7 projectiles are not more deadly than one????

The Pennsylvania Gazette
April 11, 1778
LONDON, December 24, 25.

Dec. 26, 27. We are informed the reason so many brave men and officers were lost under Gen. Burgoyne was, the American musquet cartridges were made up with one ball and two buck shot , which killed our men outright, or left them cripples forever, by being wounded in two or three different places at one shot.

Spence

 

[tg]

I believe that swan shot could be more closely defined by size as there were many different sizes that ent by the name of the game they were intended for. dove shot, Duc shot, Goose shot, Pigeon shot and so on and they while notuniform as todays shot they were somewhat standardizedby the different countries who produced them for their trade, there was also a Bustard shot for a type of crane if i recall, the main pont is that swan shot is not a tadpole shaped dripped type it was molded.

 

[George]

Swan Shot was not a particular size but was the generic pellet size between the likewise generic "(bird)shot" and "buckshot." You may presume it to be between roughly .15 and .25 caliber.

I don't know when or if shot sizes became standardized, but in his list of sizes as of 1821 Ezekiel Baker said swan shot was .266".

I found this little blurb interesting:

"THE VIRGINIA GAZETTE
December 9, 1775
LONDON, August 26.

The plumbers at the tower are now casting great quantities of buck shot in imitation of those used by the Americans."

I would like to see their setup for molding the great quantities. Notice that the plumbers are doing it. Plumb is a very old term for lead, plumber was originally one who worked with lead.

Spence

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Swan in the period was about .28 which is just shy of number one buck. Virginia militia during the F&I period PREFERRED large goose shot to the single ball for indians.

 

[wahkahchimaol.com]

When you think about it, it wouldn't even have to be lethal. All it would have to do is ruin your aim and morale as you waited for that buckshot to rip into you. And think what it would do to cavalry!

 

[Alden]

.28 is today's #2 Buckshot and the usual/largest efficient in modern 20 ga. (.62 smoothbore) loads. .28 to .33 (buckshot I would maintain) are found most commonly afield at historic battlefields here of at least the Rev. War period and on (for .69 to .75 muskets), leaning, I think understandably, toward the larger pellets.

Must've been priceless in Indian warfare I'd believe...

 

[Ray-Vigo]

I do the same as MK. I shoot it mainly for the fun of just toying with the load on paper. I'll set a target out at about 25 yards and open up on it.

My usual load from a 12 gauge 46 inch barrel is probably 70 grains, then an overpowder wad/card, then a .690 patched ball, then a half dozen #4 shot pieces, then an over shot card. As you can tell, I'm doing this at the range/bench. I wouldn't want to shoot it all day, but a handful of times in a session is fine. It's fun to see what kind of pattern/hits you can get on paper playing with that load. I've gone as high as 80 grains with it.