FFFF?

[Bad Karma]

Pressures somewhat higher have also been found.
Wonder why Russians would study this obsolete substance?

We still study it too. It’s cheap, stable, powerful enough for intended purposes and yes, it has military applications even today.

 

[deerstalkert]

and hopefully we have gathered wisdom along with the increased surface area.

 

[bigted]

Lol. Thought this was a question of "how safe".

 

[BuffaloSoldier]

Wow, sometimes it's better to ask if you don't really know what the instructions are.

 

[Irishmusket]

Well now just because the rifle did not burst dose not mean that your barrel is not damaged and become dangerous .Damage to over stressing is very real that barrel can burst without warning on the next shot even with a correct load .

 

[Britsmoothy]

Well now just because the rifle did not burst dose not mean that your barrel is not damaged and become dangerous .Damage to over stressing is very real that barrel can burst without warning on the next shot even with a correct load .

Any scientific tests to back your comment?
I have seen dozens of ringed barrels still shooting.

 

[bigstick6017555]

Well now just because the rifle did not burst dose not mean that your barrel is not damaged and become dangerous .Damage to over stressing is very real that barrel can burst without warning on the next shot even with a correct load .

If a proof tested firearm is tested at 25% - 40% over pressured, than by that way of thinking all guns could blow up at any time, under normal use

 

[JCKelly]

Any scientific tests to back your comment?
I have seen dozens of ringed barrels still shooting.

Were these Unmentionable barrels, typically made of Rifle Barrel Quality chrome-moly steel, or were they American muzzle-loading barrels, usually made of screw stock? Screw stock tends form cracks, and at some point shatter.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Were these Unmentionable barrels, typically made of Rifle Barrel Quality chrome-moly steel, or were they American muzzle-loading barrels, usually made of screw stock? Screw stock tends form cracks, and at some point shatter.

Can you show any American muzzleloader barrels with cracks in them? If so, was it caused by 4f?

I have been on a long quest to find definitive proof that using 4f is definitely dangerous but none has been found so far. Thus leading me to believe it is a myth.
I get loads of ifs and could's but no definate proof.
Ironically, I have heard of many using it and no ills to report than the na sayers submitting actual factual evidence of it being dangerous!

 

[Griz44Mag]

Can you show any American muzzleloader barrels with cracks in them? If so, was it caused by 4f?

I have been on a long quest to find definitive proof that using 4f is definitely dangerous but none has been found so far. Thus leading me to believe it is a myth.
I get loads of ifs and could's but no definate proof.
Ironically, I have heard of many using it and no ills to report than the na sayers submitting actual factual evidence of it being dangerous!

There are several videos out there that show barrels loaded to the muzzle with black powder - and a projectile forced down on top.
None of those barrels have failed from doing that.
The only muzzle loading barrels that I have ever seen fail - failed from using smokeless powders in them.
Pressures generated from black powder - of any granulation - seem safe to use.

 

[mooman76]

Were these Unmentionable barrels, typically made of Rifle Barrel Quality chrome-moly steel, or were they American muzzle-loading barrels, usually made of screw stock? Screw stock tends form cracks, and at some point shatter.

Going from this statement we should see allot of barrels blowing up.

 

[SDSmlf]

Wasn’t OP was asking about 4F in Colt clones?

How much can colt clones take before breaking?

 

[Irishmusket]

4f was used for grenades shells and fuses and for those with small flintlocks priming only .In other words 4f is for priming or blowing up something.like your musket if you keep this up you certainly will and that is for sure

 

[rodwha]

4f was used for grenades shells and fuses and for those with small flintlocks priming only .In other words 4f is for priming or blowing up something.like your musket if you keep this up you certainly will and that is for sure

4F was also found to be what the Hazard’s paper cartridges from the Civil War, and under testing found to be powerful like Swiss. They used what they called Pistol Powder. 36 grns of 4F under a 211 grn conical. Pretty impressive.
A museum curator, having disassembled late 19th century metallic cartridges for display, found that the handgun cartridges quite often had 4F and even finer powders, even in the larger calibers.

Lyman, black powder experts, listed max loads of 4F in their revolver data including the pressures.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Lyman, black powder experts, listed max loads of 4F in their revolver data including the pressures.

That Lyman Manual was the first edition of their loading manual and the use of 4f powder was not mentioned in the second edition.

 

[Old Hawkeye]

The OP asked a question about "getting more velocity" & "how much can a Colt clone take" & we are now 75 post into arguing about 4Fg powder & whether it is safe or not. This is about the 20th time this has been argued here without a resolution. Isn't it time to just stop?

 

[Irishmusket]

Any scientific tests to back your comment?
I have seen dozens of ringed barrels still shooting.

Magnaflux and 50 years experience as real gunsmith working in industry

 

[NorthFork]

Good grief. So much myth, old wives tales, and just general misunderstanding in this thread.

 

[Britsmoothy]

4f was used for grenades shells and fuses and for those with small flintlocks priming only .In other words 4f is for priming or blowing up something.like your musket if you keep this up you certainly will and that is for sure

Then why is that not stated on the can? Or, to prevent liability claims, removed from sale?
Please try to refrain from expressing wild assumptions but supply facts.
Ofcourse do express your opinion but please state that it is your opinion and not a wild self righteous ruling or judgement.
Thank you

 

[Britsmoothy]

That Lyman Manual was the first edition of their loading manual and the use of 4f powder was not mentioned in the second edition.

Probably due to snowflakes bombarding Lyman with their terrible nightmare stories since reading the first edition.