Loading question

[BIGG DADDY]

I have 2 kentucky .45 cal percussion rifles ones a CVA and ones a JUKAR. Im new to this and im not sure exactly whats the best stuff for loading these as far as patch and ball size and how much powder and what kind of caps. i also have a CVA .45 cal pistol im unsure about as well. I appreciate any help u guys can give me. thanks a lot.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Big Daddy: Welcome to the forum. The best way to answer your question about any gun is to fire actually measure the bore diameter and groove diamter of the gun. Some of these guns have barrels that can vary widely, and some are better than that. The only way to be sure, and waste much less time is by measuring the barrels. Use calipers. The bore can be anywhere from .440 to .460, and the grooves will be from .004 to .018 wider than the bore( land to land) measurement. It all depends on who made the barrel.

Let us know, and we can tell you what patch thickness and what ball diameter to try first, along with a starting load of Black Powder. There are pet loads for every caliber, but again, what will work in your gun is something you will have to discover through shooting it over a bench rest.

 

[BIGG DADDY]

Wow sounds pretty involved. Ill have to get my hands on a set of calipers and try to measure it up. thanks a lot bro.

 

[walruskid1]

pauls right to suggest measuring first but the cva kentucky usually takes a .440 ball and a .015 patch. i get very good results with that combo and 50 gr 3f bp. your results may vary. measure both of them just to be sure...

 

[Rebel]

Try a .440 rd ball and .015-.018 patch lubed with whatever type lube you care to use, even plain 'ol Crisco and about 50-70 grs of 3f powder in the rifles. Same ball and patch and about 15-30 grs of powder in the pistol.

 

[roundball]

I have 2 kentucky .45 cal percussion rifles ones a CVA and ones a JUKAR. Im new to this and im not sure exactly whats the best stuff for loading these as far as patch and ball size and how much powder and what kind of caps. i also have a CVA .45 cal pistol im unsure about as well. I appreciate any help u guys can give me. thanks a lot.

Also, there should be some sort of factory literature that came with them giving load data recommendations...

 

[BIGG DADDY]

I wish but i purchased them used off ebay and they didnt come with the literature. U guys rock i appreciate all this help.

 

[paulvallandigham]

There is a maximum amount of black powder that you can burn behind a round ball in a given caliber gun. Use the formula, 11.5 grains times Pi( 3.1416) times the radius of the bore, squared. Then multiply it times the length of the barrel to find your maximum burn. My brother just chronographed his .45 rifle with a stiff load of 65 grains, and the ball is going over 1900 fps. You don't need that kind of velocity to do good shooting. I was using 50 grains, of FFFg powder in my .45, Which was more than she could burn, and I always had burning powder falling out the muzzle. I didn't know the formula then, but do now.

I have seen very credible target shooting done with a .45 shooting only 25 grains of fffg powder at out to 50 yds. So, don't think you have to stuff much powder in that gun barrel to get it to shoot well.

 

[BIGG DADDY]

Yeah i suck at math lol. Wow man u know your stuff. Do u know what caps to use also?

 

so according to this formula i should be able to use 110 grains in my 54 as a max load.

 

[Dale A. Cathell]

Hey big daddy. If nothing has been changed you should take a #11 cap. I have a Jukar and CVA 45's also They both shoot well. Still working up a acurate load. Up to 55 grains of 3f in each and I use a .001 patch. Good luck and be safe.

 

[Many Klatch]

Hey Big Daddy, be careful with that Jukar pistol. They were Spanish made back in the 70's. We always joked that Jukar was Spanish for hand grenade. Don't try maximum charges with anything marked Jukar.

Many Klatch

 

[Blizzard of '93]

Around 20 grs. 3F as a start load in the .45 pistol and max being 35 grs. but the max won't be the most accurate load. stuff a couple patches or a felt wad atop the powder for better groups, wasp nest will work. try white Go-Jo hand cleaner for a lube/wipe down.

 

[Slake]

I had a CVA Kentucky rifle given to me that had been put together by a neighbor of mine from a kit. I shoot a .440 ball with .018 patch and 50 grains of FFF Goex black powder touched off by a #11 Percussion cap and the rifle is sweet to shoot. All rifles are different though so you can follow the above advice in measuring or try a 440 ball and see how tight it fits. You can try different size patches or even change up the ball size. Changing your setup is often a fun part of muzzleloading

 

[BIGG DADDY]

You guys are all pretty much in the same ballpark with the tips. i guess now its just a mix and match thing to see what works he best for my rifles. well when i first posted this the extent i knew about loading these was i needed a .45cal ball, a patch, and some black powder. Now im feelin pretty confident i could get a decent load set up. this forum F-ing rocks :bow: . anything else u guys can tell me i greatly appreciate it.

 

[Zonie]

I agree with the recommended ball size and patch thickness. (By the way, you will need to get something to start the patched ball into the bore.
I use a "short starter" which is a wooden ball about 2 inches in diameter with a short dowel sticking out of it for the initial start, and another one about 2 inches long to get the ball down far enough so the ramrod can be used.

Although you will get the very best results by using 3Fg black powder, 2Fg will also work.
The synthetic powders like Pyrodex can also be used in your Caplock guns.

zonie

 

[BIGG DADDY]

oh i see. how come i cant use the ram rod from the beggining?

 

[Zonie]

You could try, but the way it works is this:
The bore is .45 caliber and the ball is .440 diameter. Lets say the patch is about .015 thick.
Because the patch is on both sides of the ball, you have twice it's thickness plus the ball size that your trying to get into the bore. That's .440+.015+.015 or a .470 diameter object into a .450 dia hole.
Once the ball and patch are started, the rest is easy but starting it is usually very difficult if your just using a ramrod.

By the way, if you figure "Well, I'll just use a .440 diameter ball and a .005 thick patch! That should start easily." the problem is a .005 thick patch will not fill the rifleing grooves so it will burn thru when the gun is fired.
If it burns thru, the ball cannot grab the rifleing so the accuracy will be worse than bad.
In fact, if your accuracy is bad, find some of the fired patches and look at them. If they are cut or burned thru then either your patches were too thin, the rifleing is still sharp or your not using the right kind of patch lube.


zonie

 

[BIGG DADDY]

i see what your sayin. ok thanks a lot bro. that makes sense. :bow:

 

[paulvallandigham]

Stick with using the standard #11 caps. You do have to take a nipple with ou to check the caps to see that they fit properly on the nipple. Particularly on foreign made guns, the nipples seem to come in whatever size they decide to crank out that day. If you get to a good supplier, buy some replacement nipples that are American made. You should have much less problems fitting them to a cap size. Having extra nipples in your tackle box can keep you shooting until the next time you get to a good suppler, or can justify an order with the mail order firms mentioned here.