Rocks are more reliable than caps

[FishDFly]

I can find a rock that works in the walk to my mailbox, caps I ain't seen any.

I have more than enough, Boy Scout training!

 

[FishDFly]

Dixie Gun Works and Track of The Wolf has them. Local chert will also work. Not as good as the English flint, but they work.

The last ones I ordered from TOW had humps you could stand on in a flood.

 

[tenngun]

Sorry billraby, but I'm going to have to disagree here. I refer you to this discussion back in 2004.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/when-did-percussion-replace-flint.1419/The British switched late in the Napoleonic wars because of ease of use and also because it functioned better in inclement weather.

I was at Wilson’s Creek when reinactors were doing a demo
Wilson’s creek was in 1861, and the whole battle thing was pretty new. Much of the battle was fought at close range, and had lots of hand to hand.
The guys had four guns they demoed. 1) a rifled musket,2) a double barreled shot gun,3) a percussion civilian rifle,4) a hall breach loader.
They went through the loading, a minie, bare ball,PRB,and paper cartridge in the Hall.
Hall beat all,minie and one barrel of the shot gun loaded in the same time, PRB the slowest.
All except the Hall would have been beat by a flint musket or fusil loading cartridge
Brits and French and Americans primed from the cartridge, some German states made a large touch hole and loaded with frizzen down and the gun self primed
In the range fought at Wilson’s creek even much of Shialo a year later a rifle wouldn’t give much of an advantage. But a fifteen seconds reload vs two or three seconds capping would have made a differnce.
To paraphrase Napoleon God’s on the side with the most metal in the air
When one talks about x being better then y there is always a trade off.
A modern fighter jet is better then a WW1 fighter, but the old biplane can out maneuver tge jet.
You car is better then a model T, but a screw driver and a wrench cold fix any problem a model t had

 

[waksupi]

How else can a rocklocker assert his obvious undisputed superiority other than asserting his self appointed obvious superiority?….
Flinchlockers often indulge themselves in delusions of grandeur… I always let em.

I shot cap locks for probably twenty years before getting rid of all of them. I stand by my statement.

 

[Greenjoytj]

Wow Mr. Waksupi you really touched nerve with your original post. It has generated 4 pages of responses in less than 24 hrs.
I would agree with your observations, most people at the shooting range make lots of rube mistakes that they probably wouldn’t make if the were alone.
But I do disagree on the general principle that flintlocks are more reliable history has proven otherwise.
I think flinters just take more care in the whole preparation to load & loading process.

 

[Snooterpup]

Morning’ I’m in the fray late but I will take the stand that the opening statement is nothing short of bullfinch feathers. I’ve shot black powder since high school and am now an old coot. First gun was a Zoli Zouave. Never had it not fire. Second was an unremembered flintlock, albeit poor quality, that rarely would fire. Third, a T/C Hawken kit that never misfired. Now as an old coot, I moved into flintlocks. Rebuilt some poor quality ones, tuned locks that desperately needed it, had one really great siler flintlock after tuning and polishing, now have a Kibler Colonial, the quality is excellent, so is the reliability. Many great comments here. I’ll give a reiterated nod by restating the obvious.
Sweeping generalizations don’t take in the variables. A budget friendly percussion gun will always outperform a budget friendly flintlock in terms of ignition providing both are cleaned and maintained correctly. As said before, that is why percussion technology replaced flint and why so many flint guns were converted.
Two key things here. The shooter must perform proper cleaning and maintenance on both, regardless of the quality of the firearm both budget friendly of high end custom gun of either ignition type. The shooter must understand the needs of either type and be willing to follow the cleaning and maintenance of either.
Can a quality flintlock ignite the charge as quick as percussion? Absolutely!!! Can either system fail to fire due to poor attention to the flash channel, touchole, nipple condition, flint position or condition, dirty or damp pan, damaged nipple, and so on and so on.
I agree that experienced flintlock shooters that have the history of learning the weapon’s intricacies will undoubted have good results but I will stand behind my statement that an inexpensive percussion lock will always outperform a poorly made cheap flintlock. An inexpensive flintlock lock is a pain in the posterior and a misery.
Now, I will state my generalization (with caveats) that well designed, well built lock on a flintlock lock is a reliable joy to have and to shoot.

 

[rocullen]

Cap lock ....just as likely to be part time/beginner/inexperienced.
Flintlock....probably(not necessarily) well experienced and knowledgeable.

 

[FishDFly]

One of the most frequent trolls, guaranteed to have folks spinning around like tops.

 

[FishDFly]

Cap lock ....just as likely to be part time/beginner/inexperienced.
Flintlock....probably(not necessarily) well experienced and knowledgeable.

Huh, flintlock shooters start as percussion shooters first.

Have a new person start with a flintlock and they will be a babbling idiot.

 

[SolidLeadSlug]

Troll post, go away and knap your flints.

 

[Maven]

Waksupi isn't a troll, I assure you. He built my FL and many others as well. To his main point, reliability of either ignition system has more to do with how well the gun is maintained than intrinsic superiority of one system over the other. Btw, my Waksupi-built Isaac Haines (Chambers) is indeed reliable, but so are my Lyman GPR and T/C Renegade SB.

 

[david w]

I recently ran a pole and of the participants whom responded, 70% preferred flint! I shot percussion for many years, and they are fun. Flintlocks are funner!

 

[doubleset]

I recently ran a pole and of the participants whom responded, 70% preferred flint!

World class statistical sampling and analysis!

 

[Ames]

I own many flinters and only build flint at this point. I still have one cap lock I built. But shes my most dependable as far as shot placement for hunting. Goes off every time and bullseye accurate.
Must be a good lock and proper hammer/nipple alignment. She has a permenent place in my lineup.

 

[Patched]

I shot cap locks for probably twenty years before getting rid of all of them. I stand by my statement.

Well, you certainly make my point for me…
I flintlock too…but in a non judgmental inclusive manner…

 

[deerstalkert]

 

[doubleset]

Shorter version: People want to keep believing what they believe.

 

[FishDFly]

Can we go to the next stuck ball thread now?

 

[doubleset]

Those are SO boring. I'm just working this one in between replacing the stairs on my front deck, cutting shooting patches for my .32, and making hanging target stands.

 

[deerstalkert]