Rocks are more reliable than caps

[Patched]

Waksupi isn't a troll, I assure you. He built my FL and many others as well. To his main point, reliability of either ignition system has more to do with how well the gun is maintained than intrinsic superiority of one system over the other. Btw, my Waksupi-built Isaac Haines (Chambers) is indeed reliable, but so are my Lyman GPR and T/C Renegade SB.

All six of my percussion guns are built by me…using top quality patent breeches carefully fitted, polished and deburred and fitted with musket cap nipples (never reenactment caps RWS1085s only)…proper preparation before loading and attention to detail make my equipment 100% RELIABLE not only to fire every time, but also to hit the target.
My flintlocks are built the same, loaded carefully and are 99.8% RELIABLE to fire and hit the target…
Why even bring this up to discussion…seems a little on the snooty troll side of things.

 

[BP Addict]

I’ve shot Percussion guns most of my adult life. I bought a Flintlock back in 1995 but unknowingly filled the pan too full including the flash channel. It sprayed burning powder across my forehead every time I fired, so I sold it.

There could be several reasons for failures to fire in a Caplock.

Some of the manufacturer’s nipples are crap. I had to swap out both on my buddy’s Lyman GPR and pistol.

Substitutes like Triple Seven need more spark. I’ve fixed Failure to Fire (FTF) by swapping out for an MSM Spitfire Magnum nipple. These have a cone shape on the inside allowing more spark from the cap to reach the main charge.

Then there’s maintenance. We had one guy in our club who was plagued with FTFs. We found out he wasn’t taking the barrels off his half-stock rifles and cleaning them in a bucket of water. He was simply wiping the bore leaving all the crud in the breech. Along those lines, FTFs are also caused by wiping the barrel and pushing crude down to, and plugging the ignition port. I clean every five shots and then pop a cap before loading the next round. There are those too who use too much oil in the bore and it pools in the breech while standing upright in the safe.

I used to feel sorry for the Flint shooters who had multiple “flash in the pans.” My thoughts were “Why don’t they buy a Caplock”? I have since moved to the “Darkside” myself. I completely understand the attraction. Usually, if I have a FTF, it’s because I need to either sharpen or reposition my flint. Twenty shots on the Trail this month and not one FTF!

For me, once I got used to the idiosyncrasies of the Flintlock, my ignition is almost 100%. I’m glad I switched. Caps in my area are $12.50 per 100. Flints cost me $2.50. I’ve got over 50 shots on my pistol and over 80 on my rifle. Both are still sparking!

Thanks!

Walt

 

[Cruzatte]

....I think a lot of muzzleloader problems can be attributed to improper maintenance.

I quite agree.

 

[bud in pa]

Not everyone lives there.

Look on the net and search for chert or flint in your state. Shocked the heck out of me to find out that there is some only a 25mile drive from me. Now to find out what it looks like so I don't give myself a hernia bringing home a bunch of usless rocks!

 

[Frontier's]

I see it time and again. At our monthly shoot yesterday, pretty much every cap lock shooter were having problems getting their rifles to fire, while the flintlock shooters went merrily on our way shooting targets. I've seen the same thing at shoots for years.
Why do people stick with cap locks, when flintlocks are so much more reliable?

Yeah right! Lol if they couldn't get their caplock to go off, its user error.

 

[flntlokr]

I see it time and again. At our monthly shoot yesterday, pretty much every cap lock shooter were having problems getting their rifles to fire, while the flintlock shooters went merrily on our way shooting targets. I've seen the same thing at shoots for years.
Why do people stick with cap locks, when flintlocks are so much more reliable?

I think the secret is that the rock-lock shooters take more care. Part of the reason for shifting over to caps was that there was virtually no learning curve for the care and feeding thereof. Same with the switch to those guns that need little cans full of powder with a bullet in the end; anybody can pick one of those up and make it go bang.

 

[DaveC]

I see it time and again. At our monthly shoot yesterday, pretty much every cap lock shooter were having problems getting their rifles to fire, while the flintlock shooters went merrily on our way shooting targets. I've seen the same thing at shoots for years.
Why do people stick with cap locks, when flintlocks are so much more reliable?

They are not. You may "see it time and again" but I've certainly not. Admittedly, I started on caplocks before I got into flintlocks, but in my admittedly limited and personal experience, no way are flintlocks "so much more reliable" than caplocks. History appears to agree with me. Flintlocks gave way to caplocks precisely because they are more reliable than flintlocks. But hey, you do you. Even if delusional.

 

[Patched]

Human endeavors involving passionate beliefs, religion, politics and guns often elicit a common behavior. Acting out a self assigned righteousness, elitism or superiority is common.
The OP, while presenting minimal anecdotal evidence only for his claim, is asserting “flintlock“ superiority and his righteousness for his exclusive use of flintlocks…
Elitism is his actual message…
In my 48 years of muzzleloader experience, ”flintlock superiority syndrome” has been an ongoing affliction of the sport…like politics and religion no amount of facts can dissuade the zealot from his cause.

 

[FishDFly]

When you go to a "Territorial Match" and it is one gun, how come most shooters are using percussion?

 

[Snydly]

Started shooting Black powder in 1968. All my guns were cap locks for 30 years, now most are flintlocks, which are my favorite. I even hunt Elk, deer, antelope with my 54 flintlock. With all that being said I have had exactly 2 caps that failed to go off on time in all these years. To say that flintlocks are more reliable.... just watch some hunting videos on YouTube . Flints fail at probably 2 to 1 over precision. I love them all. Well not quite all. I won't allow an inline in our hunting camp, or in my house. Sorry if I stepped on anyones toes.

 

[Snooterpup]

Human endeavors involving passionate beliefs, religion, politics and guns often elicit a common behavior. Acting out a self assigned righteousness, elitism or superiority is common.
The OP, while presenting minimal anecdotal evidence only for his claim, is asserting “flintlock“ superiority and his righteousness for his exclusive use of flintlocks…
Elitism is his actual message…
In my 48 years of muzzleloader experience, ”flintlock superiority syndrome” has been an ongoing affliction of the sport…like politics and religion no amount of facts can dissuade the zealot from his cause.

Right on! There should be room for all muzzleloaders in this forum and I appreciate both flint and percussion. Perhaps elitists for either type, and not happy embracing the other type and may find a need to open a flint or percussion only forum. That would be too bad and counter productive to our hobby. As our numbers seem to be shrinking we should band together and appreciate all traditional muzzleloaders and their use, and contributions to our nation’s history. Just my thought.

 

[david w]

Flinters are great firearms, weather permitting.

I went deer hunting once in light rain. I was in the field almost all day before I saw a buck. I had the lock covered with a cow's knee, and replaced the priming powder before I shot. The buck went down almost right where it stood. Yes, you can shoot a flinter in the rain.

 

[david w]

Flinters are great firearms, weather permitting.

I went deer hunting once in light rain. I was in the field almost all day before I saw a buck. I had the lock covered with a cow's knee, and replaced the priming powder before I shot. The buck went down almost right where it stood. Yes, you can shoot a flinter in the rain.

 

[59sharps]

Nchawkeye some good points there. I do agree flint shooters are generally more experienced and knowledgeable and a flint gun can be very reliable in their hands.

The 90 degree turn shouldn't be a problem, easily overcome when cleaning. If you think that's convoluted you ought to see the path on my Shilo Sharps! I've shot both drum and bolster breeches, patent and regular, none of those things make any difference in my opinion.

Yea i shoot a sharps also. 2 90deg turns and a length of 1” to the breach face.
only fail to fireis if i didn’t clean properly or got the end of the paper greasy and my nipplepick fixes that problem

 

[Snooterpup]

Started shooting Black powder in 1968. All my guns were cap locks for 30 years, now most are flintlocks, which are my favorite. I even hunt Elk, deer, antelope with my 54 flintlock. With all that being said I have had exactly 2 caps that failed to go off on time in all these years. To say that flintlocks are more reliable.... just watch some hunting videos on YouTube . Flints fail at probably 2 to 1 over precision. I love them all. Well not quite all. I won't allow an inline in our hunting camp, or in my house. Sorry if I stepped on anyones toes.

I’m with you 100 percent. First BP love, percussion, best enduring BP love is flint with a real spot in my heart for both. I am eyeing a wheel-lock too.

 

[rocullen]

Huh, flintlock shooters start as percussion shooters first.

Have a new person start with a flintlock and they will be a babbling idiot.

kinda what I said.. flintlockers are more experienced...PROBABLY NOT NECESSARILY

BY MY REPLY, IT STANDS TO REASON THE NEW TO BP WILL HAVE PROBLEMS UNLESS THEY REALLY DID THEIR HOMEWORK, EVEN FLINTLOCKS, ALTHOUGH IT SEEMS THAT THOSE WOULD BE MORE APT TO DO THEIR HOMEWORK, AT LEAST THE MAJORITY.

 

[waksupi]

They are not. You may "see it time and again" but I've certainly not. Admittedly, I started on caplocks before I got into flintlocks, but in my admittedly limited and personal experience, no way are flintlocks "so much more reliable" than caplocks. History appears to agree with me. Flintlocks gave way to caplocks precisely because they are more reliable than flintlocks. But hey, you do you. Even if delusional.

When it is raining at a shoot, the cap locks are often out of business, flintlocks are still shooting.

 

[JamesA]

Which work better, caps of rocks, when you have no powder, shot or ball?

You any good at making a bow and a quiver of arrows? The Indians seemed to get along with them just fine for hundreds/thousands of years.

 

[Snooterpup]

When it is raining at a shoot, the cap locks are often out of business, flintlocks are still shooting.

Maybe some don’t have enough sense to come in out of the rain? Just sayin’

 

[FishDFly]

When it is raining at a shoot, the cap locks are often out of business, flintlocks are still shooting.

And how is that?

Why do flintlocks need cows knees and percussion does not? How come folks are always worried about dampness and the powder in the pan if they are more reliable? Huh.

What is sold more of flint or percussion?