sick of that jackass who writes for NMLRA

[Russ T Frizzen]

Yeah, Rod, but you said you'd rather read articles about in-lines than articles about the history that is a big part of traditional muzzleloading. :shocked2: That got all of us concerned fellow muzzleloaders worried about your health. Perhaps you should check into a hospital until the fever breaks and the head injury has healed properly? Best wishes and get well soon. :thumbsup:

 

[11th corps]

I know we are getting off topic, but the NMLRA needs a diverse group to keep its doors open. I will admit it, I'm a gun nut. I like all kinds of guns.
I shoot smokeless weapons-I load ammo. I shoot modern shotguns, handguns. I own an AR. And I own 3 flintlock rifles. Couple of cap guns. Several cap and ball handguns. So whats the big deal?
To keep the shooting sports alive-including traditional muzzleloaders-we need people. Lots of people. We need people who want and care about these things. If you also want to go back in time and re enact, more power to you. Its just not my thing though.
You see the NMLRA and blackpowder weapons in general as a lifestyle.
I just see smokepoles in the evolution of firearms.
Interesting, a challenge to shoot. A challenge to build.
Another in the line of the evolution of the hand held weapon.
When the next generation of firearms come along-whatever they might be-I'll be interested, may own one if the government will let me.
Doesn't mean I won't still love my smokepoles.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Just pullin' your chain. I like old Winchesters and Trapdoors myself. And Colt SAAs. It's all good--except of course for those *%&$##@ in-lines!!! :v

 

[faw3]

Right you are! Why post t all. Myself if he thinks "A" is a JACKASS, so what I've been called worse. I'll add if no one has NON in-cra..rifles didnt make the "things we better do list" = 74 read stump the experts.. the Bevel Brothers, 71% favor Notable Antique Guns", 79% Americas Yesteryears, 70% Wilderness Writings, all old gun type stuff not a word about Longhunter,or Al, if they wasn't his boys they may of became history...maybe. "Nearly all respondents requested more hands on - how to do" Especially related to TRADIIONAL SKILLS AND RENDEZVOUS ITEMS. That must of been like passing kidney stones (or something) to some at the NMLRA office! " they indicated a VERY STRONG interest in historical articles" Well well no one is wanting to see a 200 yr old Knight a :hmm: or two for that they done got slaped and they know it, a line reads "you'll be seeing changes" "some soon" (in MB.) Fred :hatsoff:

 

[Claude Mathis]

If Daniel Boone, Davey crockett or your other favorite fronterisman were to come back to life, you can bet your bippy he would not be toting an inline
He'd have an AR 15 with Superscope, and about 500 rounds of ammo. :wink:

Well, that really puts the history of our nation in perspective, for all those who have spent years studying it.

I nominate you President of the "National If They'd Of Had It, They'd Have Used It Association". :haha:

 

[Claude Mathis]

I know we are getting off topic, but the NMLRA needs a diverse group to keep its doors open.

You see the NMLRA and blackpowder weapons in general as a lifestyle.
I just see smokepoles in the evolution of firearms.

The terms 'diverse" and evolution" hardly fit into the NMLRA's own mission statement.

"The National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association exists to promote, support, nurture, and preserve NMLRA's and our nation's rich historical heritage in the sport of muzzleloading..."

It says nothing about the "evolution of firearms" or "diversifying" to include modern firearms. These are things that people say when they want to rationalize the inclusion of these firearms.

An organization is either serious about, "preserve NMLRA's and our nation's rich historical heritage in the sport of muzzleloading", or it isn't.

What some people are saying is, if you have an antique/historical car club that is specific to only one brand, say Chevy, and membership starts dropping, you should let all cars in. Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, who cares? It's just about "cars", right?

 

[11th corps]

Wow Claude, guess I hit a nerve, huh?

 

[11th corps]

What some people are saying is, if you have an antique/historical car club that is specific to only one brand, say Chevy, and membership starts dropping, you should let all cars in. Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, who cares? It's just about "cars", right?[/quote]

It is if your car club is on its way to going down the tubes because you can't raise enough revenue to keep the club in existence.
Will you be happier if the NMLRA ceases to exist but honors its mission statement?
The NMLRA is constantly issuing statements in MB magazine about its declining membership.
What really attracts new blood to the sport, especially young people.
Its the guns.
Not the history. I am a history buff, but most of my interest is in the American Civil War. I see very little in MB magazine about the American Civil War. So what, I can read about that in books, and other magazines that focus only on that topic.
You first have to get young peoples attention. There might be a limited few who actually want to rendevous, or re enact. Most kids won't be interested in that. What will get their attention, get their blood moving, stir their interest?
You do it with those wonderful smokey, booming muzzleloaders.
Focus on those smokepoles.
Maybe then we can see some people in MB magazine who do not have white hair-I can say that cause mine is white as snow.
And maybe the sport and the organization will continue on past the years you and I support it.

 

[longcruise]

I don't think the NMLRA is going to attract any kids by altering anything they print. Kids get attracted to the sport by their parents or grandparents. End of story!

And, "diversifying" to attract the inline crowd will do nothing for the NMLRA either. Those guys won't join. They buy those guns to take advantage of a special season or an additional season. Except for the few weeks preceding the ml season, they could care less about shooting those guns. And, when they do show up at the range to shoot them they shoot massive bullets over huge powder charges that send them packing after 10 or 15 shots and usually without having achieved any accuracy or a useful sight in. This I know, I see it every year at my club. Season opens in less than four weeks and I'll be going to the club to shoot sometime this week and there will be a couple of those guys there. None of them can shoot worth a d**n cause they don't care two hoots about learning how to shoot any kind of ml gun.

So, where's the positive in driving the traditional guys away from the NMLRA? That will only reduce the membership rolls even further cause the "other" guys aren't going to show up with their dues.

It is the guys with our white hair that are responsible for getting the kids excited about the smoking guns. But, we as a group, as parents and grandparents don't seem to do a very good job on that score.

I dropped my NMLRA membership 12 years ago and have never looked back. Meanwhile since then I have introduced three adults to the sport of traditional guns both shooting and hunting with them as well has having built rifles for two of them. Then there's my five grandsons who are either into the sport or are on the edge of their seats waiting to be big enough.

I'm satisfied that I'm doing my share but I don't view it as a duty to the sport. It's what I love and what I talk and teach to anyone who will listen and believe me kids do listen. But they don't read NMLRA pubications or anything else that would get them interested.

Traditional muzzle loading will not live or die by the NMLRA. The NMLRA can go belly up tomorrow and it won't change one thing as far as the future of traditional muzzle loading goes.

Many members of NMLRA who post here show great concern over the future of the NMLRA and my hat is off to them for trying to save an organization that they love, but as for me it is irrelevant.

I didn't format all that underlining. I underlined only a few words of the post so ignore the underlines please.

 

[Claude Mathis]

What some people are saying is, if you have an antique/historical car club that is specific to only one brand, say Chevy, and membership starts dropping, you should let all cars in. Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, who cares? It's just about "cars", right?

It is if your car club is on its way to going down the tubes because you can't raise enough revenue to keep the club in existence.
Will you be happier if the NMLRA ceases to exist but honors its mission statement?
[/quote]

Personally? I don't care what happens to the NMLRA, one way or the other. I'm not approaching this from the perspective of what I want the NMLRA to do. I'm not a member.

I do, however, think that an organization (any organization) should fulfill their mission statement, or change it. If the times have changed and an organization can't make a go of it, then by all means change, but be up front about it.

It would be refreshingly honest if an organization came right out and said, "We've changed. We're not just about history and heritage anymore - We now include any and all muzzleloading firearms - It's all about the guns". :wink:

 

[Oldnamvet]

They buy those guns to take advantage of a special season or an additional season. Except for the few weeks preceding the ml season, they could care less about shooting those guns. And, when they do show up at the range to shoot them they shoot massive bullets over huge powder charges that send them packing after 10 or 15 shots and usually without having achieved any accuracy or a useful sight in.

Being a range officer during our annual sight-in days before deer season, it is interesting how many times we have the person showing up with a bag of "stuff" and a rifle in the plastic blister pack. They unpack the rifle, look at you, and ask"how do you do it with these things?" The temptation is to tell them to pack the stuff up and come back when they know what is going on but I know then they will simply do something stupid, perhaps in deer camp, and cause an injury or worse. So, I give them instruction on how to properly and safely load and fire. Some shoot only a couple of times and hit reasonably on the 25 yard range. They then pack up and say they are good to go since ranges are short where they hunt. Others blast away at up to 100 yards and say they are taking the rifle back since it is defective -- they are scattering their shots all over the paper (*good - don't need them in the woods anyway*). The only thing I don't do is help them clean them but always tell them to follow the instructions and clean them when they get home. I usually get an OK but sometimes they say they don't have to since they are using a substitute powder that isn't "corrosive" like the old stuff. Whatever. Some will and some won't. The ones who will are the same ones who clean their modern rifles every time they are fired as well as wash and wax their lawn mower after each use.

 

[Claude Mathis]

[The only thing I don't do is help them clean them but always tell them to follow the instructions and clean them when they get home. I usually get an OK but sometimes they say they don't have to since they are using a substitute powder that isn't "corrosive" like the old stuff. Whatever.

I would tell them, "That's right, you never have to clean these new modern in-line muzzleloaders. In fact, they shoot much better of you never clean them". :wink:

 

[Oldnamvet]

I wonder if, for those who don't clean them, the smoke comes out pink from all the rust in the barrel? Give it some time and you will see lots of rusted out barrels on garage sale specials and pawn shop cheapies. Then they will have to buy new ones.

 

[longcruise]

Yup,see the same thing on occasion while working my clubs public sight in program. Not many ml types show up since our sight in program starts only one week before ml season.

Had refreshing experience last year when a guy and his 12 year old son showed up. They had a rem 700 ml and a previously unfired Renegade. They shot at 50 yards and could not put a conical from the 700 on paper. They set up the renegade .54 but they discovered they did not have any .54 conicals and were ready to go home. Myself, never being without my ml junk when at the range, offered to let them use some of my round balls and other needed items. They accepted and then proceeded to put one rb after anoter into a 4 inch circle off the bench at 50 yards. The kid outshot his dad!! :rotf: He consistently hit a little rubber lizard he had stapled to the bullseye.

The guy owned the renegade but had never shot it and had borrowed the rem 700 cause they were pretty sure the renegade would not be adequate. Ha! The announced they would return the 700 to it's owner and use the renegade!

 

[Greenmtnboy]

One more thing
If Daniel Boone, Davey crockett or your other favorite fronterisman were to come back to life, you can bet your bippy he would not be toting an inline
He'd have an AR 15 with Superscope, and about 500 rounds of ammo. :wink:

:bull:

If Boon an Crockett were brought back to life they would be older than dirt and in a nursing home :youcrazy:
I'm alive now and I don't use a A.R. what makes you think Crockett or Boon would.

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

I'm alive now and I don't use a A.R. what makes you think Crockett or Boon would.

MUUAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.........

AMEN BROTHA.....

 

[tg]

"It is the guys with our white hair"

I beg your pardon, my hair is platinum blond :v

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Hair? I don't got no stinkin' hair! :rotf:

 

[11th corps]

Oh, I guess from Mom.
She lived through the depression and WW2.
She lived in a farm house without central heat or even an indoor john till she was in high school.
She says only those who didn't live in the days before modern conveniences think the "olden days" were better then today.
:wink:

 

[Greenmtnboy]

Oh, I guess from Mom.
She lived through the depression and WW2.
She lived in a farm house without central heat or even an indoor john till she was in high school.
She says only those who didn't live in the days before modern conveniences think the "olden days" were better then today.
:wink:

I grew up on the Canadian border using a hand pump for water and crapping in a outhouse I was born in 1966 my great uncle's and grandfather brought canadian wiskey into VT during the 30's also living the same way.
My two great uncles grandfather ,grandmother and aunts were against bringing electricty onto the farm because "If it ain't broke why change it"
They felt being on the "Grid" would only give the fed's more control over woods folks. Guess they were right.
These were the same men who taught me to muzzleload, hunt, and flyfish.
I guess also you have never heard of Ned Roberts, you know the complete book of muzzleloading?
That was written well after centerfire rounds were invented.
Not all that live now want modern ways.
Even now my wife and I manure in a out house.
modern conviences use more resoarces than ever before, you ever wonder why the U.S. burns more energy than any other country?
My life style is NOT a fad it's my way of life.
And the old days in many ways were better, even in bum screw VT durung the deperession people were better off in a lotta ways than today.
A lot of rual America is now marked by drug addiction and poverty.
And inlines still suck!